Samus babbles unintelligent things!!
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CtrlAltDestroy
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2006 6:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Samus wrote:
We are all bound by our experiences. They are the limits of our conciousness. But in the end, the human soul will ever
reach for the truth...


When I first played the end of Fusion, this line went right into one ear and out the other, leaving me saying "Huh?" and disreguarding it as just a nonsensical phrase.

However, Since then, I have realized the meaning of this phrase.

You are a product of what you have experienced in your life.

You are the person you are because of where you were born, what kind of a life you were born into, how you were raised, what you learned, and all the events and experiences leading up until today.

Outside of the things you've learned from your experiences, you know nothing. Your version of the truth is different than the next person, because the next person's life and experiences are different than yours. Within the realm of human consciousness, can we actually find "truth"? Or will we always be bound by our faulty human perceptions based only on those things we've learned?

We may never be able to find "truth", but it is human nature to keep searching for it nonetheless.

It was only after realizing this that I remembered that Samus said the exact same thing at the end of Metroid Fusion.
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Andrew_Fireborn
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2006 9:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Steyr... You've perfectly illustrated the danger of a hands off narrative style inherrent in most of the games in this series.

The motivations of a character are often hard to really find...

Samus Aran was raised by the Chozo. A race of nature-reverant warriors, whom I would see mostly as similar to the warrior monks of asia. She has reason to hate the Space Pirates, they did kill her biological parents, as well as her semi-adopted child...

Now, it's never really said how old she is, but most of the game art I've seen I'd place her at late twenties... So, since we don't know her age at the start of Metroid or the time span between each of the games (with the exception of MII and SM... being almost back to back) we don't know how long she had lived with the Chozo or even if she was old enough to remember her biological parents... Although I believe I've seen sources placing her at about 6 when her colony was destroyed and she was rescued by the Chozo. (It was a comic other than the NP one... I believe)

But a parent (or guardian is you must) is the defining influence on a child. So I'd say Aran as a person is more likely a follower of the same path. A harsh warrior with an appriciation for the natural world and a high intelligence.

For the pirates, with a threat like that in their territory... I'd imagine the Federation has an open bounty on them and their operations. Especially after the incidents involved in Super Metroid. Therefore, she'd always have a financial reason for them to be her foe, bolstered by that very deep personal reason.

For the Chozo, I believe their acentsion was relatively recent. (It would have to be.) With the Pirates swooping in to scavenge whatever they can from the remnants of their civilization.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 19, 2006 8:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The way I see it, Metroid Fusion in general and that speech in particular gave Samus some very badly needed character development. A year or two ago, back when I still wrote fanfics and worked with various talented authors, the prevailing opinion was of Samus as a cold-blooded hunter with hardly any morals, a character so brilliantly portrayed by Moony, KefFloyd, and Chorizo. (Boy, being the lone dissenter out of a dozen authors back then was NOT fun.)

Fusion is the game where we find out that this is, in fact, not accurate at all. I read that long speech not as some deep philosophy but as Nintendo's attempt to give Samus a three-dimensional character. Who knows? Fusion certainly provided a wealth of fanfiction fodder, a trend which needs to continue. With any luck, we'll see more character development in subsequent games.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 19, 2006 1:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

... But it was because of that speech, and because of Fusion, that I started writing Metroid fic in the first place. You weren't the "lone dissenter", you know. The whole reason I wrote my "Introspections" sequence was because of the various different characterizations of Samus that were possible at the time. The whole reason I wrote "Chaos and the Aftermath" was because of the view of her as a cold-hearted killer, and what she would do if that sort of choice, the choice between life and death, were forced upon her, giving some humanity to her. Lots of authors were doing the same things we were, we were just the most vocal about it. And the whole "cold blooded killer" was Chorizo's gig, really. And he was so vocal about it that maybe dissenting with him made one feel as if they were dissenting with "a dozen". Thank you for your kind opinion of my characterizations of her as a heartless killer, but please recall that I also characterized her from other angles in other fics.

I will agree with one thing though, and that is Nintendo trying to give another facet to one of its most popular and enduring characters. While they created many plotholes with Fusion, they also made the one game where we learn far more about Samus's past than any other. Even the information the Prime manual gives us about Samus's past is pathetically minimal, and even then it's from the manual; in Fusion, it's from Samus's own mind, so the source would be far more reliable. While I'm not a fan of the various plotholes, and the attempt at sounding "deep", I think it gives more insight into the mystery that is Samus Aran.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 19, 2006 9:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the correction, it seems my memory is spotty. It's my fault, since I read "Chaos and the Aftermath" but I never read "Introspections". (Goes off to do so.)
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Steyr AUG
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2006 1:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I got my view of the cold bounty hunter from the brilliant "yodanut" on IGN's Metroid board, not this Chorizo fellow (this is the same member who got banned from here a year ago, right? Wanna make sure I'm on the same page). In it, he persuasively argues that the continued exposition of Samus's character is detrimental to the franchise, and things were far better when she was vague and mysterious, with an intangible connection to the Chozo implied.

There are times when I like when a game greatly expands on history and lore, but they're notably in fantasy-esque settings, like Fire Emblem or Zelda. The space opera-ish genre of Metroid, however, doesn't seem to fit as well for me. Maybe it's because I'm predisposed to see Samus as the suit, the weapon of mass destruction, and not the person, but I'm not digging Nintendo's attempts to bring her to life.
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2006 7:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Indeed, with the style of game we usually have presented to us, game interrupting exposition, like the elevator and nav.room scenes in Fusion would probably continue to detract from the game.

But at the same time, I would like to see more explained about the setting, and the reasons for things to be where they are. I prefer Prime's scan visor method to Fusion's, but it wouldn't be practical in a game like the classic Metroids.

And, they've kinda written themselves into a corner with Fusion though. They can continue to do remakes of the older games (hopefully, II & Super could do for portable versions.) or they're going to have to work around this massive obstacle they've placed in Samus' path.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 12, 2006 9:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, things like that are really hard to do in a 2D game, that has no real depth. Plus, no sound of voice acting makes it worse. I don't blame Retro too much, as they had nothing to work with Rolling Eyes
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 12, 2006 11:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why not take a page from fusion and super? A sit-rep report at the start of the game, and a little epilogue/debreifing ending...

That could add alot to the games, without breaking the action or handicapping speed runs with nessecary events...
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 15, 2006 5:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Despite the fact that perhaps one, two, heck, maybe 5 phrases held truth, one must admit that most (at least half) of it is simply BS.

I'm not one for all the "I think, therefore I am!" in my videogames.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 18, 2006 12:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I suppose that's true. I guess where Metroid's always been about running around killing things and saving the universe (in as little time as possible 'round these parts, hehe) having a touchy-feely philosophical epilogue doesn't seem to fit.
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2006 10:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i dont really mind what samus says just want to learn more about the story
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PostPosted: Fri May 26, 2006 6:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I didn't mind the little end speech at all. In, fact I'm glad that Fusion had Samus "talk," since it lets us get inside her head a little bit.

I will say this much about the end speech, though. I did find it to be rather wishy-washy and naive. Even if some people in the Federation understand Samus's reasons and motivations for destroying the BSL, it's not like they're going to be that forgiving. I wouldn't even be surprised if the Federation tried to cover it all up, and attempt to "silence" Samus, to keep her from telling the general populace about what really happened.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 27, 2006 5:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

!!!!!!!!!!!!! Shocked Moonlight Sonata, you're JROLANDE?!!!? (dies) Cool. Very Happy

Hee hee.. I have yet to write my own Metroid fiction. (Well.. I've got a smash bros based fic, but there's lots of Samus in there. I'm mungojerry, you might have seen my SN around ffnet. Razz )

But I've got some pretty strong opinions about Samus, basically the polar opposite of steyr aug. I LOVE Fusion, it's one of my favorite Metroid games. The design, art, music, story, content, atmosphere, all of it. I've never felt that she's a cold blooded killer who grunts more than she speaks. But I also don't think she sat down as an eight year old and said, "I'm gonna be the saviour of the galaxy!!!" like in that deplorable e-manga.

I didn't think the end speech was stupid. After you've seen it a few times, it is annoying to have to sit through again, but it's far from unintelligent. Pretentious (Not affectatious..well, maybe that too.)? Yes. Stupid? No. It actually sounds a bit Ghost in the Shell to me. And she's honestly meditating on the fact that the large majority of the federation won't like the decisions that she and Adam made, but that ultimately it was the right one, which is the only thing that matters. She's relfecting, and I like that. If you want an unintelligent game, go play Doom.

Now I'm gonna argue with Steyr. :b

" Samus is supposed to be an antihero, not a hero. When she does things, it is either out of practicality, revenge, or money. Let's look at the pattern."

>>>Okay.

"Metroid I/Zero Mission: Duh. The Federation was paying her."

>>>And she hates pirates and wha they do, having experienced their destruction first hand. She's also still connected to the Gfed. She used to work for them full time, if I'm right, before she decided to go solo.

"Metroid Prime subseries
Prime: This one's a little iffy. She got curious enough to investigate the distress beacon, and then decided she could afford to waste enough time to blow crap up."

>>>Um, actually, she was tracking the pirates that had escaped from Zebes, remember? Kill pirates. Pirates evil.

"Hunters: Again, being paid by the Federation."

>>>I'm tellin' yah, she's still connected to the Gfeds. She's probably a little bit curious, too, who wouldn't be? And I imagine she wouldn't want someone theoretical like Kanden to get a hold of such a thing. Not the mention the explorational opportunities such a thing would portend.

"Echoes: Once again, under contract by the Federation to find the Marines. However, she decides to investigate a bit more, since her ship is damaged and is repairing itself. Furthermore, I would imagine she wants to know what the hell a Dark Hunter that looks like her is doing on the planet, not to mention recovering her stolen equipment from the Ing."

>>>And she helped the luminoth.

"Prime 3: We don't know yet."

>>> Well, she's encountered phazon before and knows the twisting, "corrupting" effects it has on life. Why would she want something like this to spread? Not to mention dark samus and the pirates assaulting the galaxy. What, she's gonna sit back and watch? Right.

"Metroid II: Return of Samus - Again, paid by the Federation."

>>>And she knows that Metroids are a dangerous threat. Need I mention the sparing of the last, and the subsequent gameplay sequence? Flowers, jumping, stars, and beautiful music? The genteel chirp of the hatchling? Man, I loved this game too. Dang awesome design concepts.

"Metroid III: Super Metroid - Now this one's the iffiest. I say she wants to finish off the Pirates once and for all, though others say she has a "connection" to the baby Metroid and feels obliged to save it."

>>> Uh, the metroid just feel into the hands of the pirates again. DURR!!! You've GOT to stop them! Not to mention that she probably does have a sort of connection to the hatchling. Don't tell me you didn't go "!!!!!!!!!!!" when you saw the broken capsule after Ridley, or yelled "DIE B****!!!" after Brain killed it.

"Metroid IV: Metroid Fusion - At first, under a Federation contract. After seeing the destructive power of the X, she decides to eliminate a dangerous lifeform from the galaxy. But... in this game she suddenly takes it upon herself to become the "savior of the galaxy," "the chosen one," blah. The feel I got in the previous games is that she was aware this was what the Chozo believed of her, but she couldn't care less.""

>>> ...huh? When? You're just quoting that emanga (BLEAGHETTH!). We're talking about the games here.

My opinion of Samus can be most easily summed up as "Batman." She's cool, she's not sugar-pop or Captain Planet, she's a kick butt, super intelligent fighter-protector motivated by her own experience and a thirst for righteousness. I think she's kind of like a cop. Smile Hee hee... See? Batman. I'd also venture to say that she does like the action and the fight, as well as the exploration, discovery, and, I think, research(!?). She and the fed scientists probably would've had fun had the x not been involved.

One of the other reasons I like Fusion's ending was, and I know a lot of you will balk at this, she's not alone anymore. It's sad to be alone all the time. What's the quote? No man is an island? Well, now she has the critters and Adam, her own weird little family. I'm not saying I want them super active in the games or something, or to be exchanging hugs and kisses, but its nice that she doesn't have to be alone anymore.

However, I wouldn't mind Adam being active in future games. He can act as a resource and plot development tool. I know everyone hates him because he told you what to do and where to go, but, guess what?! I'll bet the next game won't take place on a space station where he has all access to sensors, logs, and locks.

So yeah. Me like ranting. Kerazy
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